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Well, thanks quite. I wish to give you all a break for a moment and also rely on Mr. Swartz. You've been really patient, the three of you. I appreciate that quite. Generally, we would certainly have had 2 panels, but we really did not recognize just how the Senate would be operating today, so in an effort to make certain we made it through all the treaties today, we did this as one panel.

Swartz, you explain in your testament and your statements that the treaty with Bermuda also punctures financial institution secrecy as well as supplies a mechanism for us getting the info we require. There have actually been some common legal aid treaties that consist of arrangements related straight to sharing financial institution records or various other monetary information.

That was an arrangement that was drafted as well as embraced in the context of the E.U.

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Under that provision, arrangement's possible for the requesting party to celebration information as info whether an account exists in the requested countryAsked for or in the case of instance E.U., one of the requested member asked forParticipant After that, the request, if there is a recognition of an account, need to be complied with up through a typical mutual legal support treaty.

And with regard to Bermuda, our document of cooperation has been really excellent. Our company believe that the document we carry the manufacturing of documents, consisting of financial institution records, is such that we are positive that the provisions consisted of in this common legal support treaty, which do need teamwork on the manufacturing of documents, will be sufficient to guarantee that we acquire the documents we need for our economic investigations and various other examinations.

Some various other MLATs also permit for urgent, non-written type requests to be made. It's my understanding that in Bermuda, it needs to remain in written type. Any type of reason that arrangement was not consisted of in this agreement? Mr. Swartz. Mr. Chairman, while it is real that the Common Lawful Assistance Treaty does require demands in written type, it was the judgment of the arbitrators that it was sufficient that, in this situation, with respect to Bermuda, we would certainly be able to get expeditious reactions to our requests as well as additionally supply such responses to Bermuda's demands, specifically due to the fact that we have a technique already established that will certainly proceed, we believe, under the treaty of being able to communicate those requests via email or through fax.

Senator Cardin. Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson.

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Bermuda withstood that because they wished to ensure that the requests were clear and in a more formal method. However in the arrangements, it likewise came to be clear that they approved that such request can be made by fax or by e-mail. The actual concern they were concerned about was not discovering a quick methods to make a request, yet truly simply taking oral demands off the table.

So we're confident that we've obtained the ways in position that we can make urgent demands of them in a manner that will certainly be efficient. Mr. Swartz. Mr. Chairman, if I might add, in truth, while it is an advantage to be able to make dental demands, in technique, it's extremely rare that we do so.

Senator Cardin. My primary worry is simply, in urgent issues, that it's not postponed. As well as with contemporary communication, it appears to me that can most likely be managed. I'm much more worried about financial institution records. Mr. Johnson, do have any type of talk about the bank documents issue? Mr. Johnson. Again, not particularly on the bank issue.

The distinction in between being able to do a dental demand or being able to make use of among these other very fast means, we assume, is not substantial. Legislator Cardin. There have actually been some problems increased regarding the adequacy of Bermuda law with respect to forfeitures of proceeds and instrumentalities of criminal offenses.

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Mr. Chairman, we are. The Mutual Lawful Aid Treaty in Article 17 does obligate Bermuda to offer support to the United States in process associating to loss of profits and also instrumentalities of criminal activity, to the extent allowed by the law of Bermuda.

We have actually had 2 examples of successful ask for restriction and loss of properties. Both instances were a success as well as we had the ability to acquire the funds. As a general matter, aid is readily available under the laws of Bermuda, as well as I do assume that is essential to tension, when it come to cold, taking, as well as limiting assets, including for issues associating with terrorism as well as terrorism funding.

It must be kept in mind that forfeiture support is not limited to what is allowed under Bermuda's domestic regulation. With regard to a UNITED STATE order, Bermuda can not forfeit a details agency of nondrug offenses, because that power does not exist domestically. Again, that's restricted to instrumentalities in nondrug crime cases.

Senator Cardin. In the Bermuda agreement, there's an arrangement that is not unfamiliar to us, where Bermuda can reject cooperation in resources instances.

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Are we prevented as a result of that or is there a method in which we are able to cooperate under this treaty, even in those cases? Mr. Swartz. Mr. Chairman, we think as well as we wish we still would be able to cooperate. Bermuda indicated, as well as has recommended the United States, that it books the right to reject support in capital cases where the sentence includes a possible death sentence, counting on the-- in contrast to the important public law provision of Write-up 3 of the convention.

As a matter of fact, we have that experience with other nations that have actually placed similar interpretations on the shared legal support responsibilities, and also we have actually had the ability to exercise arrangements in a number of instances that permit us to get evidence or talk about whether the proof is substantial enough to go ahead with some sort of further actions being taken.

Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson. Yes, Senator, if I could simply include in that, one of the factors this treaty took as long it did to negotiate and also end is since it was necessary to us to ensure that there wasn't an express limitation on support in funding situations in the treaty itself.

Swartz associated to you. And also that method we assume that assists preserve the concept that is very important to us, that such participation must be available, irrespective of the type of situation. And also we think this has actually additionally substantiated with some other nations, where despite having similar worries about cooperation in capital cases, they have, for example, had the ability to offer support to the nonpenalty phase of a test or another celebration investigation.

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Senator Cardin. They do hold the right under this treaty to refute cooperation where the United States criminal justice system is looking for resources penalty? Mr. Johnson. Senator, they hold the right under the treaty to not provide help in situations that are in contrast to public law or their important rate of interests, as well as they have actually informed us that they interpret that to enable them, in execution situations, to exercise that.

I just desired to make it clear that they would not be an infraction of the treaty. We comprehend their analysis, that if there was a case pending below that we needed their assistance, where, clearly, the district attorneys were seeking the fatality fine, Bermuda can determine not to coordinate under this treaty.

Swartz. If I could claim, Mr. Chairman, importantly, the treaty would need, since this would certainly be a denial under Article 3 of the treaty, that initially there had to be appointments with the United States, prior to that denial might go ahead. And I think that's a vital facet of the negotiation that Mr.

Instead of having a specific provision, this is among a collection of conditions under which help might be refuted after appointment, and, to name a few points, that there must be factor to consider regarding whether aid can be given, based on such conditions as the asked for nation regards essential. And also our experience because respect has been that we frequently can find proper assurances to enable proof to be created, at least for initial analysis of the value of proof in case overall.

As well as I think that would be practical for us to have that details in this committee. Ms. Mc, Carthy, you have the simplest work right here, because this agreement was formerly accepted by this board. As I said in my opening, we authorized it also late in the 111th Congress for action.

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Have there been any significant changes in our financial investment connection with Rwanda since last November when you gave statement on this treaty? What we have actually seen since last November is a boost in United States investment in Rwanda, as well as I can give you a few instances.

In February of this year, we have Hilton Hotels; it's is going to open up a major resort in Kigali. As well as, likewise, Marriott Hotels is entering to promote the country's growing friendliness market. So I would certainly say that, provided this pattern of boosted financial investment, that it is vital that the securities be afforded for them.

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You additionally pointed out the fact that the United States is discovering various other reciprocal investment treaties in Africa. I believe we have five current bilateral investment treaties in Africa. Can you simply share with us other countries that the United States has shown rate of interest in discussing treaties?



I think that finishes the questioning. I do appreciate your persistence with the committee as well as thank you extremely a lot for your testament today.

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As set out below, we would certainly such as to provide upgraded info on reported U.S. investment activity in Rwanda. In 2009, the stock of UNITED STATE foreign straight financial investment in Rwanda was $1 million (according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis).

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And I think that would certainly be useful for us to have that info in this board. Mr. Swartz. Thanks. We would certainly be thankful to supply that. Legislator Cardin. Ms. Mc, Carthy, you have the most convenient work here, because this arrangement was previously accepted by this committee. As I stated in my opening, we accepted it as well late in the 111th Congress for activity.

Have there been any considerable modifications in our investment partnership with Rwanda because last November when you offered statement on this treaty? What we have actually seen since last November is a boost in United States financial investment in Rwanda, and I can provide you a few examples.

Additionally, in February of this year, we have Hilton Hotels; it's is going to open up a major hotel in Kigali. And, likewise, Marriott Hotels is going in to assist in the country's growing hospitality industry. So I would claim that, provided this pattern of enhanced investment, that it is necessary that the defenses be managed for them.

You likewise mentioned the truth that the United States is checking out other reciprocal financial investment treaties in Africa. I believe we have five present bilateral financial investment treaties in Africa. Can you just share with us various other nations that the United States has shown rate of interest in negotiating treaties?

I assume that completes the examining. We may have some added concerns for the record. As you understand, the document remains open for 24 hrs, so you get a break. That's a pretty fast turnaround time for this committee. But I do appreciate your patience with the committee as well as thanks significantly for your statement today.

Answer. As set out below, we would love to offer updated details on reported UNITED STATE investment task in Rwanda. Apart from these updates, the responses provided by the Department's witness in the 111th Congress remain accurate. In 2009, the supply of UNITED STATE foreign straight investment in Rwanda was $1 million (according to the Bureau of Economic Evaluation).

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